Tango Argentino > close contact *ahem* in close embrace

Discussion in 'Tango Argentino' started by Peaches, Feb 27, 2006.

  1. Peaches

    Peaches Well-Known Member

    Well, I agree and disagree with your first point. At the most fundamental level, you're right. Whatever is going on in the guys' minds is of no consequence to me--it DOES come down to how comfortable the woman is. Me, in this case. But I'm more apt to be comfortable if I know in the back of my mind that there's nothing icky about what's going on the the guys' minds, most of the time. ;-)

    For example, one guy I dance (ballroom) with will often lead moves which involve him touching my hips. I don't mind at all--we flirt and joke and are comfortable with each other. Then there was this guy in a group class who touched my hip repeatedly, and I just about decked him. Why the difference? Well, the first guy has always treated me with respect, and I know the flirting is just that. The second guy, on the other hand, seemed to think that my boobs had ears, and despite being told by the teacher the correct placement of his hand (shoulder blade area) insisted on keeping a hold on my hip. Pretty low down on my hip, I might add. Besides, he addressed me as "Baby" which just ticked me off from the get-go.

    Now, about my friend. This is her first experience with partner dancing of any sort. I told her about how to control the amount of contact involved, but she's still very apprehensive. I intend to show her and teach her a bit before starting, for this reason. But, she's seen pictures, and is kind of uncomfortable about dancing with someone other than her husband, so this tango thing is kind of flipping her out.

    As for you, try it with open embrace. I think it's harder, and loses some of the beauty of the dance, but it's a good intro. Keep in mind that when I talk about "intimacy" I don't mean anything in a sexual way. I mean intimacy in the sense of sharing such a special time with someone, completely focused on each other. You never know, you might get hooked! Be careful!
  2. Peaches

    Peaches Well-Known Member

    Aah, it's like you read my mind. I don't know names for most things (well, I know ocho, giro, barrida, and abrazo, but that's about it) but the "molinete" you describes sounds about right.

    Yep, momentary contact happens. It doesn't really bother me anymore, except to signal sometimes that I'm not being careful with my posture. When I first started and it happened it's not that it flipped me out, more like I was concerned that I was doing something wrong. And then I had to go read about "the dreaded flip-up" and I really got paranoid! lol

    Since then I've realized that it just happens with certain moves. Like I said, i don't know names, but it happens when the lead is intruding on my leg space. I'm working on getting to the point of not noticing. Which also entails getting to the point where my posture doesn't lapse!
  3. DancePoet

    DancePoet Well-Known Member

    Good point Sagitta ... got me to recall those early days of starting out with dancing ... it was obviously something a bit different then the open embrace. And like you, moved beyond it. :cool:
  4. DancePoet

    DancePoet Well-Known Member

    Exactly ... and leading is where it makes sense for our minds to be. :cool:
  5. DancePoet

    DancePoet Well-Known Member

    Ah ... the wise Sabor is revealed here. :notworth:

    And here ... the humorous Sabor. :lol:
  6. DancePoet

    DancePoet Well-Known Member

    I was going to suggest that maybe she could read our postings here on DF, but then you spoke of what you weren't going to tell her. ;) :lol:
  7. DancePoet

    DancePoet Well-Known Member

    Hmmm ... Shooshoo, here in the U.S. I've seen AT classes that start out with open embrace first. A person can get comfortable with this first, and then proceed to learn close embrace further down the line.
  8. DancePoet

    DancePoet Well-Known Member

    Good point ... and with partners I'm unfamiliar with, my best AT dances have been those in which close embrace was used with my partner after we started with open embrace. As we became more familiar, found we were having fun, and accepting of each other, it seemed like a very natural thing to move into close embrace.
  9. Sagitta

    Sagitta Well-Known Member

    And I've seen beginner classes where it always is closed embrace. :p
  10. DancePoet

    DancePoet Well-Known Member

    Ayuh, me, too.
  11. Shooshoo

    Shooshoo New Member

    But there's no guarantee/assurance to know whether a guy's mind is 'icky' or his degree of 'ickiness'. So that's why I always think to accept what I personally can handle. I don't trust men, except after proven they they're trustworthy.

    I KNOW I can get hooked easily, that's why I want to stay away (control freak).
  12. Shooshoo

    Shooshoo New Member

    that's the mean Sabor
  13. Shooshoo

    Shooshoo New Member

    that makes sense to me :)
  14. bonz

    bonz New Member

    My 1st close embrace class was intense. The teacher started us out with a lecture. Either reslolve to get over the shyness or quit right now.

    She had us stand very close to a follower without touching for a couple of minutes. The she told the leaders to open their arms and let the followers find a comfortable close embrace position.

    I have been dancing close embrace for 6 months and am still a little uncomfortable being that close to somebody. But I go ahead and keep practicing with many different followers. I am getting more comfortable with close embrace.
  15. cornutt

    cornutt Well-Known Member

    Well, since the original question was asked:

    (Disclaimer: I've only done a little bit of AT, but the same general principle applies in ballroom.)

    Generally, the only time I notice any particular contact with any particular bits is when we first get in frame. There's a moment of "hmm, that's nice". But once the dance starts, the mind moves on, and after that it just all winds up subsumed in the general feel of the dance, as Sabor said. The only other time I notice is if there's some problem. A while back, I tried to do a waltz with a partner that didn't have a lot of experience, but she wanted to try it in body contact. I had danced with her before, but only in an open hold. So we tried it... she just absolutely smashed her chest against me, so hard that I could tell she was wearing a front-closing bra. :shock: I couldn't help but notice! It wasn't particularly erotic, though, because I was annoyed at her for not staying in a proper frame.
  16. hepcat

    hepcat Member

    This reminds me of a funny/annoying incident. I was at the Balboa Rendezvous last year and there was a girl (very well endowed) who was wearing some sort of moving gizmo under her shirt. Connecting with her set it off and it was very disconcerting. It made me feel like I was having heart palpitations. I want to say it was vibrating, but that's not exactly the right description. It's more like it was hollow and had something revolving inside it very quickly.

    My first guess would have been that the doo-hicky was strategic, intended to keep guys from wanting a close connection with her, but by the way she acted and the grin on her face, I think she had it there only as a sort of gag/joke. I found it very distracting, especially in class when I was trying to pay attention to the instructor. I didn't say anything though.

  17. Peaches

    Peaches Well-Known Member

    Oh, my goodness, this reminds me of something similar that happened to me this past weekend.

    I was asked to dance (American ballroom)tango by a fellow I had never met before. Usually I start off in open hold but things just DID NOT work out that way. He seemed to want to dance in closed hold...fine...I don't know you, but fine...so OK. Except I don't know who had taught him how to do closed hold, but it was nothing like what I've been taught. He had his right arm clamped so hard around my shoulder blades (yes, he extended his arm--more like AT hold) he just had me absolutely squished against him. I was ticked.

    I don't think he meant it in a lewd way, but I have no idea what his deal was. I tried leaning back into his hand/arm, thinking that maybe he was just putting on more pressure to try to "find me." Nope, didn't work. I tried outrightly pushing him further away with my left hand--didn't work either, and it's hard to get leverage at that angle. Finally I moved my hand to his bicep, and "lightly pinched" ;-) whilst pushing him back. He got the point.

    After he led open steps, I was very deliberate about not getting back into a too-tight closed hold.

  18. fascination

    fascination Site Moderator Staff Member

    hmm....could it just be lack of consideration...i know a gent who is just very rigid in what he thinks is proper hold...and of course he only dances in contact...and I have to say that since I mostly dance on ly in contact it never even occurs to me not to unless the guy pushes me away...and if a guy was similarly accustomed I could see him not even percieve a ladie's issue with it...not an excuse but also maybe not a jerk........
  19. Peaches

    Peaches Well-Known Member

    Very true, very true. A lot of times there is no way of knowing up front.

    That's why I was curious to hear what the men here had to say. Sure, there's no way of knowing what a particular guy is thinking, but I find it helpful to hear that most men seem to be thinking of either how to lead (if they're new) or the overall beauty of the dance (if they're experienced).
  20. Peaches

    Peaches Well-Known Member

    I hear ya! The absolute rigidity of the hold was one annoyance--I felt I should be able to indicate that i wasn't comfortable and have that respected.

    The other part, which I now realize I didn't communicate very well...it happens, is that this was not even close to a correct closed hold, as far as I understand it. Contact from mid thigh through abs-ish, no? Ther should be some sort of separation at the top of the ribcage through shoulders, correct? Oh no. This was contact from thigh, through abs, chest and shoulders SQUASHED against him. My nose would have been dug into his chest (he was rather tall) had I not kept my head back in an extremely uncomfortable postion.

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