Comp Organization--Stuff We Like - Stuff We Don't Like

Discussion in 'Ballroom Dance' started by ChaChaMama, Sep 25, 2005.

  1. Mr 4 styles

    Mr 4 styles Well-Known Member

    i hear ya llamas and latingal but it is what the market will bear organizers report rising numbers of entries at each event so thats capitalism
    LOL nice
  2. fascination

    fascination Site Moderator Staff Member

    yes, and no....yes, it's a drop in the bucket compared to everything else we pro am dancers have to pay, so we pay it...

    however, the ballrooms do not have increasingly more non-dancers coming in to watch (unless there is some sort of heavily advertised local DWTS event folded in to that session)...AND, even with the pro-ammers, we will cut back elsewhere by not going to sessions that we don't dance, or by shopping the vendors less, etc....which is also not good for the comp, as then the vendors opt out of going to that comp
  3. Mr 4 styles

    Mr 4 styles Well-Known Member

    agree fasc and good morning btw glad you are doing well...

    this is one topic i see as an unmet challenge. Id like to see more peeps in the ballroom during the day sessions but im not sure its just a financial issue.. i think we all need to generate more interest in dancesport as a viewers venue like tennis golf etc the loss of TV exposure has not helped
  4. fascination

    fascination Site Moderator Staff Member

    and I would note that I see that drop in vendors on the up tick...big time....and fewer vendors at a comp, reciprocally, makes the comp feel less attractive to me....because, on the occasion that I do need to shop, I like to have choices
  5. Mr 4 styles

    Mr 4 styles Well-Known Member

    good point the mrs would concur


    ohio is the nieman marcus flagship store of ballroom
    j_alexandra and fascination like this.
  6. fascination

    fascination Site Moderator Staff Member

    I think organizers need to invest in advertising to the public (if they really care, and I am not sure that they do)...I can direct my friends to the website all day long...and I have tons of folks who ask...but they are not sites that are friendly to those who do not understand comps....couple that with a $20 fee to watch 20 minutes of your friends' dancing, prolly ain't gonna happen....and, (cough) considering dwts et al, it isn't (imv), because of less tv coverage
    Mr 4 styles likes this.
  7. fascination

    fascination Site Moderator Staff Member

    and one of the few comps at which my favorite vendors are in attendence
    Mr 4 styles likes this.
  8. Mr 4 styles

    Mr 4 styles Well-Known Member


    my wife loves Dierdre of London so ditto


    with regard to TV i meant as an athletic event viewing (not a reality show), like figure skating, golf etc

    ESPN etc
  9. fascination

    fascination Site Moderator Staff Member

    interesting...I wonder what the effect would be....
  10. Mr 4 styles

    Mr 4 styles Well-Known Member

    id love to find out star streamers thought there was some market so perhaps someday
  11. fascination

    fascination Site Moderator Staff Member

    most of the folk I know who watch are; dancers :)..
  12. latingal

    latingal Moderator Staff Member

    I am always asked by my friends (and acquaintances) when I will be dancing locally so they might see me dance. I have had upwards of 10-15 people attend a day session that would not have attended otherwise (and most pro-am ladies can say the same).

    When the entry fee to the ballroom was lower in the $15-$20, I did not feel that having them come was asking a large financial outlay. When the fee in to the ballroom crossed in to the $25 range, I stopped letting people know when I would be dancing (except for my closest friends). In that price range, I don't want others to feel obligated to have to spend the money to see me dance.
    Debra likes this.
  13. ChaChaMama

    ChaChaMama Well-Known Member

    This.

    People like my secretary at work will ask me when I'm dancing locally. I can't have people who are friends but not super-close friends paying $25-35 to see me dance. So even though when they say "Oh, be sure to tell me when you are dancing in Maryland! I would LOVE to see you!" I don't tell them.

    My family members and very closest friends are a different story, but for sure I would bring a bigger cheering section if the ticket in were more in the $15 range.

    As to capitalism: it's a balancing act, isn't it? Do you want the greatest profit margin per unit or do you want to sell more units? If each single dance entry at a comp were $75 instead of (typically) $35, would you enter as many events? If your favorite airline were charging $100 more to fly the route you need to fly, would you switch to a different one? If your current favorite cookies are $3/box, would you still buy them if they were $10/box?

    My inner circle might well drop MORE money on a comp if the daytime ticket price were more reasonable. Clearly, the organizers of most mid-sized NDCA comps could accommodate more capacity during the daytime. They have made the calculation that they are better off with the guaranteed higher admission ticket for the dancers than dropping that price to try to attract casual spectators. I get it. I am not sure that market research would support their conclusions, but I do get it.
  14. Bailamosdance

    Bailamosdance Well-Known Member

    Charge less or free for casual folks at the ballroom door.
  15. debmc

    debmc Well-Known Member

    Out of curiosity, does anyone actually know the amount (range), an organizer actually takes home as profit after a successful mid sized comp? The costs they expend to put on the comp and pay for the facilities, advertising, space, staff, judges, decor, etc, etc , I wonder if they make a substantial profit or not. That might have a lot to do with all the extra costs added in everywhere? I honestly have no idea.
  16. danceronice

    danceronice Well-Known Member

    Again, the problem I have with this is letting people wander in and out ups the odds of theft. If someone who ISN'T there to dance has to pay to get in the door, even $10-15, they are less likely to be someone who's just looking for bags left under a table.
  17. Bailamosdance

    Bailamosdance Well-Known Member

    I disagree. People who are thinking of larceny go where they think they can do well, and an entry fee is not an obstacle. Paying to enter a room, a party, a club, etc is they way people get in. And guess what? They will do their best to fit in and blend in. So they are not the cartoon thieves but will look like your fellow competitors.
  18. tanya_the_dancer

    tanya_the_dancer Well-Known Member

    To me it depends on whether or not there is pro stuff in the session. $20 for daytime is OK to me, but $35+ for evening is OK only if there are pro heats in that session. For example, we had a bunch of people go to Nashville Starz. Thursday evening session was $35, even though there was zero pro heats in it - all pro-am rhythm multidances. The end result for the organizers is that those of us who might have gone to just watch it, didn't.
  19. tanya_the_dancer

    tanya_the_dancer Well-Known Member

    I am with DOI on this. It's like leaving your front door unlocked. A lock or even a security system will not stop someone who is determined to break into your particular home no matter what, but it will prevent teenagers looking for trouble from opening your door and taking whatever grabs their eye (I am not making this up, I had something like this happen to my family a couple of years ago because we got very lax about making sure we lock the front door. Not anymore.). IMV, an entry fee of something like $15-$20 somewhat prevents a random opportunistic thief from walking into the ballroom and making off with an unattended purse or something like that just because it was unattended.
    danceronice likes this.
  20. tanya_the_dancer

    tanya_the_dancer Well-Known Member

    However, there's an optimum price point which brings in most profit. Above it - you don't make enough sales because people are turned off the price, below it - you make more sales, but the profit from each is not high enough. Even though a higher price might still be within acceptable range (i.e. I've seen single dance prices vary from $20 for a very small local event to $50 for USDSC - the latter number is from 6 years ago, I don't know it it's still true - so anything in between these two numbers I'd consider within acceptable range for a pro-am comp), it will not bring in the same profits as lower one, because people would either cut back on a number of entries or won't come at all. I wonder if anyone has ever done marketing analysis like this for a dance competition.

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