Tango Argentino > how to do enrosque ( for a man)

Discussion in 'Tango Argentino' started by aaah, Oct 28, 2012.

  1. JohnEm

    JohnEm Well-Known Member

    It just suits your purpose to misread and misrepresent other people's
    experience. That incredibly limited geographical area you belittle just
    happens to be the originator and source of the dance and the music.
    You should give it more credit.
  2. Subliminal

    Subliminal Well-Known Member

    Could we get back on topic?
  3. fascination

    fascination Site Moderator Staff Member

    yes...if the subject has been exhausted, folks can move on....
  4. dchester

    dchester Moderator Staff Member

    Yes, variations on this basic theme all sort of get lumped into the collection of things called enrosques. I have no reason to doubt this was the original one, though. I really think that's what we were talking about until the thread got sidetracked. What I really like is when they do a weight change at the end of the enrosque, coming out in a planeo.
  5. tangomonkey

    tangomonkey Active Member

    Never heard of this couple before - Diego Blanca and Ana Padron. Found their YouTube site a few weeks ago. Lessons are pretty good.

    Here's the one on the enrosque. (Essentially how I think about them too). He starts from a left foot front sacada into the giro with enrosque and exits with a lapiz to a parada. (Alex Krebs does the same sequences in Vol. 3 of his iPhone tango APP.)

    And they have a lesson where Diego does a planeo. Is this what you have in mind dchester? I've never tried that before.

  6. opendoor

    opendoor Well-Known Member

    I have seen old footage with enrosques done prior to Petróleo. But perhaps they recovered wider consciousness now. The pivoting on on foot while the lady is marching round also can be found years before Petróleo in cuban danzon.
  7. opendoor

    opendoor Well-Known Member

    Leave it. You will not master it because they keep the technique still secret. Only "Sending her first and just following with my body" really is more than only distressing little information! Still miss a dis-like botton.
  8. dchester

    dchester Moderator Staff Member

    Thanks for the links. The top one is actually closer to what I was talking about. He said it was with a lapiz at the end (my error). However I've seen it done with rotation continuing after the weight change into the lapiz. I'm not consistent enough with it yet, but it's on my (long) list of things to get better at.

    The bottom one is actually easier (at least for me). It can also transition smoothly into a barrida, if you are into those. It's just not too useful, since it can't be done when it's crowded.
  9. Subliminal

    Subliminal Well-Known Member

    Do you mean continues from lapis to planeo? Or lapis to needle to lapis?
  10. dchester

    dchester Moderator Staff Member

    Yeah (Both) There are several variations on this stuff that for whatever reason I've been fascinated with, (and been working on in my limited spare time).
  11. Subliminal

    Subliminal Well-Known Member

    Neat! I've always liked the second one. It is a guilty pleasure. ;) I have some great notes on it from different teachers if you ever want to share.

    Planeos on the other hand... I am not so good at. It may be balance, or it may just be I've never found a perfect pair of shoes. I have no problem with actively pivoting myself, but when I have to balance with someone else turning me, everything goes to heck. :D

    ETA: The same thing goes for calecitas when I'm following, actually. It could just be because I'm a big guy... heh.
  12. dchester

    dchester Moderator Staff Member

    What seems weird for me, is that if I keep my feet together, while pivoting on one foot, I basically have no issues leading. However, when I pivot (again on one foot) while doing an enrosque, I'm very inconsistent when coming out of it. Thus it's not "milonga ready" for me. I'd appreciate any notes or tips that you have.

    At some point, I'll probably have to break down and take some privates to figure out what I'm doing wrong.
    I'm normally the largest guy at any milonga I go to. (Let's just say that I'm not built at all like a dancer.)

  13. Subliminal

    Subliminal Well-Known Member

    Yes, coming out of the turn consistently is hard, something I'm still working on. I will dig up my notes. If I recall, the biggest tip I received was to sync up with the follower on the pivot. So she goes front, I go front with a sacada. She pivots and goes side, I pivot and enrosque. She finds her axis and grounds the sidestep, I, at the same exact moment, put my heel down and ground the enrosque. Etc.
  14. AndaBien

    AndaBien Well-Known Member

    You didn't ask me, but I'll say that I often overcome problems by making sure that I maintain my axis well enough. I've been working on a CW giro for some time and I find that if I "stick" the axis, it will come out reliably. Sometimes a hip or a leg gets loose, or a shoulder tips. For me it's a matter of having greater focus on the whole movement, not just pieces of it.
  15. LadyLeader

    LadyLeader Active Member

    My enrosques are also in training mode. When learning a new thing some of my focus is in my own body making my lead less powerful and a sensitive follower picks that up and starts to step hesitantly.

    It was helpful when she started to take the giro steps as early as possible, to go as fast as music and my upper body turn allowed. She was actually before me on her counterclockwise giro circle. So there is some learning for followers too, at enrosque activities.

    When the turning was stable it was easier to decide when and how to step out.
  16. Steve Pastor

    Steve Pastor Moderator Staff Member

    This is something I look/feel for in my partners when deciding what comes next. often, I will notice too late the first time. But once I know she knows how to do it, and does do it... It enables things.
  17. dchester

    dchester Moderator Staff Member

    I'm now suspecting that I might not know what you mean by "stick the axis". Could you explain what it means to you?
  18. AndaBien

    AndaBien Well-Known Member

    For me, it means getting my hips, shoulders and head (3 main centers of mass for humans) directly lined up over my point of contact with the floor. If one of those is out of line even a tiny bit, turning movements get wobbly.

    For that CW giro it's even more complicated than that, because other things are also moving in various directions.
  19. Steve Pastor

    Steve Pastor Moderator Staff Member

    To me, one of the things that identifies a better dancer, especially with a style like apilado, is how well defined my partner's axis is. I think it's no coincidence that someone like Laure Haile, who was dance director for Arthur Murray studios in the 50s, and documented "Western Swing" addressed the question of simply taking a step. Many of these things relate to most partner dances.

    So, my partner and I take a step. If she establishes her "axis," that is, a clear line between her grounded foot on the floor, and her "center," and I can feel that in her body, and there is no momentum there, I know she is available to move in any direction. Or, she will very likely not move off that spot unless I lead further movement where there is no rotation involved.

    Both partners, I think, cooperate to make things work. I think there is always more or less "wobble" in that a vertical axis through through the body won't be 100% vertical 100% of the time as we rotate. The more accomplished dancers understand that, and compensate for each other. (Course the better they are, the less they have to compensate!)

    Hope that makes it more clear.
  20. AndaBien

    AndaBien Well-Known Member

    Quite true, regarding my partner's axis. I want her to let me feel her axis, physically, and I try to do the same for her. This applies especially to apilado.

    In the context of enrosques, (open embrace, leader revolving on a spot) I think it's more about the leaders axis being independently perfect. Disclaimer: I don't do enrosques.

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