Dancers Anonymous > STOLEN check FRAUD alert!!!

Discussion in 'Dancers Anonymous' started by Standarddancer, Jun 28, 2012.

  1. Standarddancer

    Standarddancer Well-Known Member

    Be aware of STOLEN check FRUAD and bank is NOT helpful!

    DP had a credit balance of $500 from Capital One credit card, he asked for refund check on 5/7, check was stolen on 5/24, someone forged his signature badly and deposited check; Capital One such *******, only provided a very bad image of front & back of check image, endorsement so blurry that can't even read the endorsement bank or acct #, the morons at Capital One said they won't issue a replacement check and it is not their responsibility to verify signature!!!! :((((( Their fraud investigation department won't do any more work than providing this bad image of endorsed check, they told us that we'll have to report to police find the thief by ourselves and ask for reimbursement!!! What kind of fraud investigation department is this??? So negligent and totally unhelpful !!! They don't even care customers out of pocket for $500 because victim of fraud:(

    The funniest thing was he called a few times on 5/25 and 5/26 asking why refund check hasn't arrive, he felt something wrong, normally does not take so long for check to arrive; irresponsible customer service reps kept telling "just wait for another 5 to 10 days, it is on your way", if on 5/25 or 5/26 when he called, they had spent the time to check into it, they would had already discovered someone other than him already cashed check!! In fact, Capital One didn't start fraud investigation until 6/11 although check was stolen 5/24, delayed 19 days!!! now end of investigation, they said they won't issue a replacement check and we'll have to find thief ourselves based on the bad image of endorsed check they provided.

    What else would be done other than police report? I'm not confident with police either. I had shopping bag stolen from car, they did nothing to help, friend's car got towed, NYPD couldn't even locate the location of his car, was me found location of towed car by searching place #:(

    Now this really concerns me since now post office can easily deliver mail to the wrong address, and unauthorized person can open mail and if sees check, could deposit to their bank account! Actually 9 out of 10 times when you deposit check, bank clerks don't even see if the name on check matches with name on bank account. Or thieves can just set up fake account with similar names and steal checks.

    Really concerns me what if I sell my dress and customer send me a large check and check got stolen? Once check deposited (even unauthorized endorsement), still the legit payee has no claim once stolen check was cashed???? :(

    Maybe in the future I'd rather deal with huge paypal fee and take only take payment thru paypal??? I don't trust post office or bank now.

    What are your suggestions when you can't avoid the situation of receive a check by mail?
  2. Katarzyna

    Katarzyna Well-Known Member

    You can use a shipping service with signature requirement so not use regular mail. Also if dress is expensive, the wire transfer fee through bank will be cheaper than paypal fee.

    Again, sorry this is so difficult, I know this process has been frustrating for quite some time with this bank.
  3. jump'n'jive

    jump'n'jive Well-Known Member

    Stay far away from pay pal. It's garbage and you are bound to have even more money stolen from you.
  4. Standarddancer

    Standarddancer Well-Known Member

    Thanks Kat. Yes I've thought of send check with signature requirement.

    And bank wire, I would only give my bank acct # to people I know. Give bank # to some stranger is also scary, isn't it?

    Why PayPal is garbage jump n jive?
  5. samina

    samina Well-Known Member

    never had any problem with paypal...

    SD, so sorry to hear about your problems with capital one.
  6. 3wishes

    3wishes Well-Known Member

    So sorry about the check. I've done bank to bank wire - in a variety of situations. Fill out some forms, pay a fee (depends which bank your with) etc etc.
    I've also sent "mail" requiring a signature pick-up and confirmation...
    and I've never had an issue with PayPal - ever. Do what you feel will work for you.
  7. jump'n'jive

    jump'n'jive Well-Known Member

    paypal can and will freeze your account when ever they feel like it for no reason on your end. if you have any high dollar transaction goodluck. they cry fraud for just about anything these days. google paypal sucks and read the reviews and all the class action law suits against pay pal. i'm about just over 2k from using there service and i dont see them returning that money to me anytime soon
  8. Katarzyna

    Katarzyna Well-Known Member

    besides being convenient paypal has one big drawback. They are protecting the buyer only not the seller, the buyer can at any moment claim an issue with the item and paypal will freeze your funds. I haven't had issues personally but heard really bad stories from people
  9. Joe

    Joe Well-Known Member

    If the check was stolen from the US mail, i.e. before your partner received it, then you need to get the USPS Inspector General's office involved.
  10. jiwinco

    jiwinco Active Member

    Another option is either squareup or intuit for your smart phone. You won't be able to swipe the card, but you can get the card info over the phone and process the transaction.

    Because you won't have the card to swipe I would get email authorization to charge their card so it doesn't come back to you. The transaction fee is lower than paypal with fewer issues. There is no monthly fee so you can keep the account open without any additional costs.
  11. Standarddancer

    Standarddancer Well-Known Member

    Ok update, at police precinct, police said Capital One must issue a letter stating that fraud occurred on 5/24 when the stolen check was cashed. The bad image of endorsed check is not sufficient for them to make report and start investigation. So we called Capital One right on the spot at police, the account manager just firmly stated they don't have such policy to issue such statement, it is police's job to start investigation, their job is done! What a jerk!

    We put account manager on speaker phone with the police officer, after officer explained to the manager police can't start investigation unless bank issue such letter, she put us on a long hold again, then came back reluctantly gave us a fax #, told us to put our request in writing and fax to them, they don't take customer request by phone call etc.

    So wrote letter and faxed. So wait again!!! Really frustrating. Can't believe capital one don't even want to stand up for their client for difficult situation like this:( First they said victim bear the burden to proof fraud, then said it is police's job to catch thief, not theirs!
  12. Standarddancer

    Standarddancer Well-Known Member

    I also heard some bad stories of PayPal protect buyers, heard bad stories such as bad customers shipped an empty box back to seller, claimed goods there and returned, to get money from paypal and put seller at loss.

    I think it is safe and ok to get payment from friends and good buyers via PayPal. PayPal is fast, instant! Bank wire maybe takes up to 3-7 business days?

    Sometimes buyer don't buy dress until a comp or show scheduled so close, so trying to finish transaction ASAP. In this case PayPal ok.

    Is it usually sender pay bank wire fee? Or both sender and recipient must pay?
  13. jump'n'jive

    jump'n'jive Well-Known Member

    certified over nighted bank cashiers check or bank wire transfer if dealing with internet sales. if your buyer will provide their credit card info via email or text then use squareup like mentioned before. ANYTHING but paypal.
  14. DanceMentor

    DanceMentor Administrator

    We've done many thousands of dollars on paypal over the years as a seller and I have a team assigned to me at paypal, and they are super at helping me solve issues. I love paypal. There have been a few problems over the years, but wherever possible they helped me, and I am very loyal to paypal.

    I know there can be some unlucky situations where dishonesty is involved and paypal can't always solve every problem, and those are unfortunate.
  15. Standarddancer

    Standarddancer Well-Known Member

    Certified mail helps little bit against stolen mail / check, but doesn't do much. When someone sent me certified mail, post office allows anyone just to sign the package. I had helped friends and family members sign certified package or mails requires signature, post office staff never asked an ID, which means thieves can sign as anybody's name and steal the mail / package.

    I also experienced mail order package stolen, online tracking showed status as "delivered" but I never received package, must be post office delivered to wrong address and signed by whoever dishonestly accepted package and that person never returned to me. Luckily that time my visa card just credit me money back without any questions.

    Just watch out post office, they makes tons of mistakes and their customer service almost does not exist!
  16. White Chacha

    White Chacha Active Member

    Sorry about what happened! But I could see from the CC company's POV. From their end it could just as easily be that the legitimate recipient of the check cashed it, then claimed they didn't get it.

    As you've pointed out, the process of validating signature info is largely based on faith that most of the time honest people are involved. When they're not, watch out!
  17. Standarddancer

    Standarddancer Well-Known Member

    From multiple conversation with multiple bank manager, I don't feel they doubt that we are lying trying to get this check twice, I only feel Capital One staff are inexperienced and managers don't care about customers. Maybe they were also pissed that DP closed this account and they feel "since you are no longer customer, why should we care?" it is a mistake to close the account before such issue resolved. Should keep account open but not use it so bank feels he's still customer and probably more willing to help.

    I also don't know if bank check victim's credit history or other financial info before they choose how to treat the customer? Maybe they checked his credit so so, does not have a high credit score but he does at least make minimum payment on time definitely not delinquent, I'm wondering if he has a super high credit score, they would treat him with more respect and care? But still, this is discrimination to treat customer differently based on credit score or other financial info!!!

    In my opinion, Capital one really sucks!!! I informed my friend who works as a controller as a multi-million Real estate business, she is upset with what happened with us, she says she would difinitely close all companies capital one bank accounts and credit cards and give business to someone else. She also feels customer service terribly, although the business give them millions of dollars business.

    I informed all students, friends and families. All people had responded that they will never do business with Capital One again. Nobody wants to put their money with a bank does not care or appreciate customers!!!
  18. Standarddancer

    Standarddancer Well-Known Member

    Just came up with another idea of sending money - Western Union or Money Gram, it's instant within minutes, with a fee cheaper than paypal. Just sender must bring all cash to local WU or MG location to send, recipient must provide an ID + must have the passcode from sender to receive money. Spelling of name must be exactly same as receiver's ID.

    Just must really safe-guide the passcode, and best for recipient to go get the money as soon as receive the passcode. Usually Western Union or Money Gram is fast, there is option of send cash within minutes.
  19. Warren J. Dew

    Warren J. Dew Well-Known Member

    Normally you should be able to fill out and notarize an affidavit of forgery that you didn't receive and endorse the check. The payer would then take that to the bank that issued the check, and that bank would reverse the payment. Ultimately, the money would come out of the account of whoever cashed the check - or if that account had been closed, the bank that account was with would be out the money for failing to get a valid endorsement. That's the way it was handled in the one or two cases I've had over the years.

    It may be a little different in this case because the credit card company may have both written the check and been the bank the check was written on. Or maybe the recent regulatory changes have affected things. Or maybe I just have better banks or credit card companies.

    Should this be moved to general discussion?
  20. Standarddancer

    Standarddancer Well-Known Member

    I also thought an affidavit of forgery would be sufficient for them to get money out of the endorsement bank, but Capital One said they don't have such policy for sending out affidavit and the victim bear all the burden to prove fraud to police which really sucks! The worse was even when at police, they tried to argue with police officer that their job is "done" so they can even refuse to issue the letter stating fraud occurred. The policy officer handling the case even said they are such horrible bank, never seen bank don't care about customers to such extent !! The officer even thanked us for reporting it, she said she would also tell all the people she knows not to do business with Capital One bank since they are just trying every possible way to get away their responsibility of helping customer!!

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