the quantal shift - good to great and fast?

Discussion in 'Ballroom Dance' started by elisedance, Jan 1, 2009.

  1. elisedance

    elisedance New Member

    I think you hit the nail on the head there - it DOES read as if all you have to do is shed your inhibitions and you can dance like mirko and alessia. Far from it - as you say, letting yourself dance becomes as much a R brain challenge as thinking about what you are going to do for LB driven dancing. The good thing, however, is that you can indulge in LB training without harming your RB process. And you can even do the two at the same time. I'm finding that some dances are more easily switched - FT, W, VW and possibly T, whereas QS is a late starter, for reasons mentioned.
  2. katandmouse

    katandmouse New Member

    I've said this before on numerous occasions. This is because they MISunderstand what RB dancing is. I can't stress this enough. It is HEIGHTENED awareness; it is not unconsciousness. You can better control your body AND your technique in this state. I feed my body and mind whatever information I think I need to get the job done, then I stop thinking about it and let it happen. Sometimese it takes a lot of trial and error, sometimes it comes quickly.

    My experience with people who are resistant to this approach, is that they never really let go enough to give it a fair shot. My girl friend is one of these. She finally started reading the Zen Body-Being book and she said what she was missing was the knowledge of HOW to get to that quiet state. I'd tell her to do something without thought and she'd be thinking out loud the entire time even after I told her to be quiet. She is one who has to do the quieting exercises off the dance floor.

    I'm of the mind though that many may never be able to dance or learn to dance this way. And I'll leave it at that.
  3. dancepro

    dancepro New Member

    I love this post, thank you SG for posting it. I especially like the car analogy ha ha. You sure know your Ferrari.:p

    :car: honk honk.... here I come with my RB seeing the whole scenery and my LB warning me about the speed limited;) and other potential dangers.

    Dancepro
  4. dancepro

    dancepro New Member

    It is not easy to do RB dancing. Most people have heard the noise of the LB for so long, they don't hear the noise any longer. I promise, it does become easier with time. You will have to develop the tools and knowledge to get the "Judge" to get quite and stay quite until asked for input. You were at least willing to give it a go even though it was tough, I take my hat of for that. There are many people that are not even willing to give it a fair change to see if it really will work for them or not. They are so addicted to their habits and paradigms that, if they don't keep doing what they have always done, they will suffer from withdrawal symptoms. In the movie "what the blip do we know" this subject is very clearly explained. You have taken over the control of your mind and body, the struggle will lessen with time, I assure you. ;)

    Dancepro
  5. dancepro

    dancepro New Member

    In this state of mind everything slows down to a feeling of slow-motion movement. You therefore have the time to make all the necessary correction as issues come up. You will make as many mistakes as before but you will have the time to correct them before they escalate into major issues that causes you to have to stop to regroup.

    Dancepro
  6. Angel HI

    Angel HI Well-Known Member

    I can tell from the posts of the past couple of days that you guys are getting this, and it's cool! A couple of adds.....
    Fasc said it most recently...of course one has to think in order to properly educate/train the body to do what dance requires. You would never say that the best way to learn in school is to just sit there, and never do any of the exercises. The answer, though given many times in many ways throughout the thread, is very well repeated here....

  7. dancepro

    dancepro New Member

    This way of getting the whole picture first and then taking it apart is by no means a new idea. There have been and is many teachers/coaches in many aspects of life, that believe this way of learning creates wonderful fast results. I do think the RB method was somewhat of a secret among the average dancers, at least here on DF. The reason I come to this conclusion is that this thread has had many more visitors then the average thread normally has. I know that some are totally against this thread and this way of doing it. They are of cause welcome to believe what ever they choose to believe in. I have just seen a hunger for knowledge in this way of doing things that I didn't really notice before, mind you I haven't been around for that long. AHI tells me that this issue has come up before but only to be soon forgotten. For some reason this thread seems to have many dancers reading the posts and feeling safe enough to post their own wonderful experiences with this way of dancing. I am grateful that so many people have had such a wonderful time with this way of dancing. As I said before this is not a new idea but I do want to explain a little about my main teacher.

    He was a very successful dancer but retired very early because of his partners knee problems. He started teaching seriously in the late 50's to the early 60's. He soon became known as a great teacher, with a talent for getting the best out of every couple, he taught. He started teaching very high ranking couples right after he retired. One of these couples ended up winning 13 world championship titles. At one time I asked them why they started taking lessons with him. He was "only" 4th in the world and they were world champions. They each had very different answers to the question but the interesting thing was, it was basically the same thing. She said that, he was the only one, that had ever been able to get her to just be and not worry about the outcome. He said that, he was the only one, that had made him realize that technique was not the end all and be all, but there was something greater then just being technically correct.
    It was at one time said that if you wanted to get into the semifinal or final in the big competitions, you had to have lessons with this teacher. He was not involved in any organizations or any groups. He didn't take any political stand, yet most couples worked with him and love their lessons with him. He was a very gentle and quite man with a heart of gold. Everybody loved him and many had/have stories of what he did and said. The lady world champion mentioned above told me, he taught every semifinalist and finalist there ever was except for 8 couples and that was from the early 60's until the late 90's. Needless to say he was respected by all his students but he was also very respected by his peers. He always used the RB approach with every couple that he taught. Every lessons was unique and different from one another even though they followed the same approach. I only watched him work for about 10 years but he was always consistent in his approach to the dancing.

    The idea that I posted here is just repetition of what my teacher told me was the fastest way to get good. I used it on myself with fast success, I used it on students with fast success and many of my students now teach this with the same fast success rate. As far as I remember, what Elise asked for, was to get good fast. If somebody else has an as fast way or a faster way then this, then they should come out as say so. It seems to me the only fast way that has come up on this thread is the RB approach. I would love to hear of a different way that could get my students better even faster. Please let us know if there is a faster way to get good then this. I am all ears or I should say... I am all eyes.

    Dancepro
  8. Angel HI

    Angel HI Well-Known Member

    You are correct. As we have discussed, my backstory largely parallels yours, and, just tonight, I was, again, reaffirmed that this method is of the best. Several students who had taken the dance class from several other teachers, came to me to say that the class (not looking for kudos, at all, here) made the dance much easier, and that they learned much quicker. Some might argue that this is b/c they had the class before. Perhaps, but I taught these people, and...no, they hadn't.
  9. elisedance

    elisedance New Member

    When I posted this original question I had, of course, no idea what it would bring. I had always felt this dichotomy between how I was learning to dance and dancing to compete with how I felt to dance and danced in social situations. I felt there must be a different way. This post was really a plea to the dance gods for guidance.

    Of course, one never expects such calls to really be answered. The oucome is nothing short of astonishing, gently guided and tended by dancepro :notworth:. Some of these ideas have been raised on DF before - notably by AngelHi (sorry I did not listen earlier ;)) - but in little pieces, almost as cries in the DF wilderness but these were always suppressed by a deluge of technical political correctness. What this thread did was to provide a nucleating place, a safe haven to discuss RB theory and practise, where those that need the input and ideas and also those that were doing it already but did not know it, could hear from those that really understand it.

    I'm not sure why I posted this right now - I think my RB told me it was appropriate to do a recap on the thread after dancepro did a long post on the history of the method :)
  10. dancepro

    dancepro New Member

    What I think Angel HI did, was plant a lot of seeds over several years. He patiently kept watering them and watering them, in the hopes that one day, they would sprout and become a beautiful garden.

    You, my dear Elise, had the first seed to sprout as you in a way were asking "what is that" while looking at the tiny little sprout. You asked the question and I then gave the seed a little water and your little seed started growing to a notable size and then into a beautiful flower. ;)

    If Angel HI had not planted the seeds:notworth: and then watered them all these years.:notworth: Then when I poured the water out, it would have served no purpose, it would have been wasted. I am grateful to the patience and perseverance that he showed in keeping this seeds alive for such a long time.

    Thank you Angle HI, you are a true angel.:D

    Dancepro
  11. Angel HI

    Angel HI Well-Known Member

    De rien. But, no thanks needed. Few of us get rich from this...most of us do it b/c we love it. Just keep learning and growing, and applying same to other aspects of your lives. That's thanks enough. Well, the riches would be good, too. :)
  12. dancepro

    dancepro New Member


    I still think you should be thanked..at least I would like to thank you. I do agree that seeing and hearing of the great experiences wonderful and that the ideas should be taken into other aspects of life.

    In regards to the riches... the universe will pay you;) I promise

    Dancepro
  13. Some guy

    Some guy New Member

    Thanks to Angel HI, Katandmouse, Elise, Dancepro and lot of the others here, I've actually learned to take my enjoyment of dancing to a whole other level. For those of you who already had that enjoyment before this topic came up, I envy you!!!
  14. Angel HI

    Angel HI Well-Known Member

    And, this is what makes it all worthwhile. Glad to hear it SG.
  15. elisedance

    elisedance New Member

    SG - yes indeed, and I am learning as much - perhaps more - from those of us who are trying to apply the ideas including of course you :)
  16. dancepro

    dancepro New Member

    It is really great to hear that some of you really got it. I was hoping when I joined DF, that I could at least help two people change and discover some of the insights of dancing. I promised my teacher to pass the insights, that he had given me, onto 10 dancers. I am a little OTT so I set out to pass it onto 20 dancers. When I joined the DF I had helped 10 professionals and 8 amateurs to understand the insights. So I was missing two amateurs to be done. I have now fulfilled my promise. I will now be able to retire content and happy knowing that the information is out there. I would like to thank you for listening and helping me fulfill the promise that made to my teacher.

    Dancepro
  17. elisedance

    elisedance New Member

    Well, if we all comit to the same pretty soon it will be normal and one day there will be a thread on here on 'LB dancing, the radical approach' :D
  18. flashdance

    flashdance Active Member

    Someguy - lovely to know - it brings on a whole new feeling when you feel at one with yourself dancing. Keep with it :D


    Sorry, but this post has been nagging at me all day to respond.

    You obviously need to upgrade to the 'Dukes of Hazard' honker ;)
  19. tanya_the_dancer

    tanya_the_dancer Well-Known Member

    This is something that came up on my lesson today. I was told that I need to live in the current moment, especially when I dance. Not sure how that's going to work.
  20. elisedance

    elisedance New Member

    well...... there's over 1,200 more posts above our heads that you might want to read ;)

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