Discussion in 'Ballroom Dance' started by pygmalion, May 9, 2004.
Though if based on technical merit wouldn't that encourage sandbaggers?
I was actually losing site of that until you mentioned it.
But I think for that reason, after 100 heats, does it really feel like you won anything? You either get a whole handfull of stickers or a stack of ribbons. A hundred or more of those and it is like those black and orange wrapped peanut butter candies at holloween. You know, the ones you just throw away. With a bag full of that, the big award is like getting a supersized candy bar.
To be honest, competing USABDA, the awards are usually very small but have a lot of meaning for us. We have never won a level the first time we competed in it. Many times, we don't even make the final the first time. But over time, moving up in a level, getting recalled, then getting in the top 3, all are great feelings. It is more like those black and orange wrapped candies are in short supply and most don't even get that. So if we go home with couple of them, we are happy. NDCA just doesn't seem to have the participation in Amateur American Smooth and Rhythm, exept at the bigger comps. Hopefully that will change.
That's where an organization-wide database tracking proficiency points would come in handy. Of course, we can't even get that now....
The emphasis on technical merit or monetary expenditure/number of heats varies a lot depending on how the comp is structured, I think. Just a thought.
Yes but that would mean the people who play fair would prosper and we can't ahve that now can we? :shock:
Of course not Tasche! This is America damn it! Every person for themself! Let's roll!
Forgive me for throwing out all of my computer sense, but I think we may need to pitch a solution for the sandbagging system, which can be managed at any level, with no excuses (i.e. insufficient hardware, no IT staff, not enough money, too many competitions, etc.).
Why don't they just turn our USABDA cards into bus passes, and every time you point-out of an event you get a hole punch ? If you lose your card, that's an automatic 3 punches/points!
I think even USABDA central can understand this concept... it's a client-side data tracking system that fits in your pocket!!!!!
The great thing about your idea is that it's been used in Europe for a while.
Unfortunately os NDCA side is not so much as a matter of whether it could be but whether it WOULD be done. There was a thread on that other bb about sandbagging at the pro-am level and I see it becoming worse with all the new national titles and then the pro-am worlds they'll be holding in Jan. The tempation is too great and the restraints too little.
That being said now where did put my tire iron? :twisted:
Are you saying we should finally make that smart chip in the Amex Blue card useful for something... that's where we can store our proficiency points!!!!
You mean the chip actually meant for something useful I though it was just to keep the checkout chicks amused
what is sandbagging???
Deliberately entering a level lower than your abilities in order to "win."
How common a problem do you think that is at competitions? :?
It can actually be reletive, but I think you should compete at the level of instruction you are receiving. If you only dance Bronze at comps but take lessons and social dance at Silver, I think you should compete silver. But that is just my opinion, I could be wrong.
For Amateurs at USABDA comps, you only have to move up when you get 3 proficiency points in that level. Although there are a few ways to earn points, it is usually winning First in a heat that had at least a semi-final danced. So if I danced Bronze Smooth and it had a semi-final and I took first, I get one point. Unless it is Nationals, then that is an automatic point out for that level.
But I rarely wait to get all my points before moving up. I actually pointed out of Bronze Smooth because I won Silver. With two official Bronze points I could still dance Bronze, until I got a point in Silver, because points at a higher level count at the lower levels. That Silver point actually meant I had 3 Bronze points and could no longer dance Bronze.
But on the other hand, I dance Amateur (Couple) Championship Rhythm Level at NDCA comps and even win, but I don't dance Championship at USABDA comps yet because I am just not at that level yet. The competion for Amateur couples is much more fierce at USABDA comps. Now if I dance NDCA Championship level and there is a semi final and I win, according the USABDA Rulebook, I still get a point for Championship level, and that point moves down to Pre-champ as well. I could concievably point out of PreChamp by winning Championships at NDCA comps. But that has not happened yet because I have yet to dance a semi-final heat at an NDCA comp. The heat must have a semi-final for points to be awarded.
It is even more complicated than that, but Darry Martin is the proficiency point expert for USABDA and I see him at many comps. If you go to the USABDA Website and request info on proficiency points, you will get a chart composed by Darry to assist you in counting points.
Interesting, Dance Am. Thanks for the info.
I am dancing bronze this weekend (smooth & rythym) and am starting to take my lessons in silver. I just want to see how I do in bronze sinze I've only competed one other time. And, at that time, 2-1/2 years ago, I was a fairly new dancer (expecting to be in newcomer, in fact); my teacher put me in bronze and I was up against women who danced bronze in competition for 3-5 years. It was pretty intimidating. I didn't really come away feeling very good even though I got first place in two dances.
I feel that I need to boost my confidence a bit before I compete at silver level. Although having said that, I'm finding the bronze syllabus to be completely boring and am looking forward to adding a little more challenge into the dance!
You didn't come away feeling good bc you weren't competiting with other chicks at your level. Unfortunately I see how the cycle works. Someone stays in a level so long and then they get "slaughtered" so they end up doing the same things and the level becomes perversely into something its not. BTW for those out there not familar with proficiency points Pro-ams dont get any hence forth you'll see sandbagging more often as "techinically" its legal expect for a few instances its not
Well, it can't really good for the sport if people who are capable of gold, or even good silver, to be dancing in bronze. It's not very encouraging for us newbies, and if I kept facing this, at some point I'd come to the realization that my money might be better spent elsewhere.
But, I can only go out and do my best and not worry about anyone else, right?
I am considering buying the tape of my comp. I assume it will be helpful after I get over the initial shock. Eeek! Kind of scary to think about!
I'd recommend buying a tape at your competition, as they are a useful learning tool. And then as time passes, you can look back and see how much you've improved.
The tapes can be quite expensive, but you might be able to save a little money by bringing your own blank tape.
And don't forget to get pictures!!! 8)
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