Underturning in Viennese Waltz

Discussion in 'Ballroom Dance' started by Tenehill, Dec 12, 2007.

  1. tangotime

    tangotime Well-Known Member


    Have also used that term for multi yrs--- trying to remember if it was Scrivener. ( or Binnick ? )
     
  2. elisedance

    elisedance New Member

    :roll: - don't know either 'fraid! Are they still around?
     
  3. tangotime

    tangotime Well-Known Member



    Unfortunately - No-- both were the teachers for many of todays current coaches-- Len was the inspiration for Tango as we now know it-- and both were inimitable on the comp. floor .
    Both still highly revered in the "industry" .
    If you can locate a copy of Scriveners book--" Just One Idea" , it will be an eye opener- revolutionary for its time ( seventies ) on tech. and theory .
     
  4. elisedance

    elisedance New Member

    thanks TT - I will look out for the book - I once had a ballroom instruction book collection but it was lost during a move. Its time I restocked and that sounds like a gem.
     
  5. contracheck

    contracheck New Member

    I mentioned underturning as an exmple that might have caused you drink at noon. At any rate, I wouldn't get high on a drink from high noon in fear of becoming like Brittany Spear. We need you on dance fllor and not in a rehab.
     
  6. pruthe

    pruthe Member

    I think it was mentioned earlier that heel turn technique might be useful to adjust for partner who takes shorter steps going forward. Another place this might be useful is when doing rev turns at top and bottom of oval LOD, although my pref is to do nat turns here.
     
  7. cornutt

    cornutt Well-Known Member

    I've done it by accident a few times. My instructor frowns on it, though.
     
  8. elisedance

    elisedance New Member

    might be a cute way to slow down forward action and avoid a collision though... think I will try it tonight..
     
  9. JoepiE

    JoepiE New Member

    :twisted:
    I do a fen (or is it fan??) hockeystick... :p

    Try overturning your natural turn in VW, it sure makes those nasty crowds on the side run for their lifes.
     
  10. elisedance

    elisedance New Member

    :lol: I'll let DP know...
     
  11. Al Gisnered

    Al Gisnered Member

    Heel turn in VW

    Actually, I sometimes use heel turns for just the reason being discussed - followers not getting the full turn. It's certainly not a competition technique, but it is kind of handy in a social situation. If my partner of the moment isn't getting her full turn, a couple of heel turns will often coax her into it.

    Also, I sometimes use a heel turn to make the back half of my turn very tight and the travel a lot shorter - great for when I'm 1.) afraid that the space behind me has closed up and 2.) not sure my partner is watching the traffic.

    As an aside, I was also taught to cross on natural turns - again not a competition technique - but handy if a social partner looses her offset.
     
  12. JoepiE

    JoepiE New Member

    I sure hope we all agree heelturns VW don't match.

    In the case of helping an underturner I understand the idea, but isn't that like buying a car when you need a place to sleep. You can sleep in a car, but it's not made for it.

    What I mean is that you could also take smaller steps and take a bit different directions to help the infamous underturner get around.
     
  13. Chris Stratton

    Chris Stratton New Member

    Actually they do match - perhaps not quite a foxtrot type heel turn, but a sort of on the spot foot pivoting action that is at least partially on the heel.

    This isn't the way to dance a competitive Vw, but it can be the way to accomplish what should the the consistent goal in any dance situation of an easily flowing dance, in a situation where taking three actual steps on the back half is either not possible or not appropriate.
     
  14. JoepiE

    JoepiE New Member

    It's the easily flowing I was thinking about. turning on your heel makes you have to stop the progressive movement and that makes the VW not a VW anymore.

    Wait a minute, a heelturn in a fleckerl would be legal then! :cool:
     
  15. Chris Stratton

    Chris Stratton New Member

    If your heel turns make you stop progressive movement, then wouldn't they make your foxtrot not foxtrot anymore?

    There is a difference between slowing and stopping. When the dance itself is not covering ground so fast, the person on the inside of the turn may be going very slowly indeed, but hopefully they have not actually stopped.

    In a circumstance where the allowable amount of movement is quite small, it can make a lot of sense to dance step-together-pivot instead of step-step-close. Just because the feet have stopped progressing after one step does not mean that the body has, and even the actual turn of heel turn progresses by most of a foot length in the feet.
     
  16. gary718

    gary718 New Member

    Sometimes when social dancing if I get a partner that is too timid or unable to take a long enough forward step to get by me.
     
  17. cornutt

    cornutt Well-Known Member

    Would that make it a fleckheel?
     
  18. elisedance

    elisedance New Member

    As apart from a fleckhurl (which sounds quite accurate actually...)
     
  19. Al Gisnered

    Al Gisnered Member

    The person going forward doesn't stop progressing. She wasn't going to go very far anyway. At least now she feels free to come all of the way through, getting all of the way around. That way we can keep moving down the floor.

    The other benefit (remember I'm talking social dancing) is that the follower never knows I've done it. She seems to think we just got better "connection" and she was able to dance better. So the dance got better.

    Pleasing the partner is what it’s all about, for me.
     

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