disqualifications at ballroom comps

mamboqueen

Well-Known Member
#61
What an 18 year old lacks in funds, they probably make up in physical speed, flexibility, etc.

And for the record, I was working a pretty good job at 18; I would venture to guess I had more expendable cash at that time than I do now (with saving for retirement and my kids' college education). Of course, I was paying minimal rent back then...
 
#62
Leaving out situations where a rising pro cuts a deal with a promising amateur for mutual exposure, my guess is going to be that most high placings in pro-am scholarships go to those at least age 30, but it is just a guess.
 

pygmalion

Well-Known Member
#63
Chris Stratton said:
When I look at the Embassy amateur form, I see only under 21, over 35, and over 50 - and for only the open level events - the lower level events appear to be a single age category.

What is confusing about embassy is that their pro/am form includes "am/am" events often called student/student - a sort of 'no teacher' variation on pro/am run under pro/am rules rather than amatuer rules. The subtle clue is that it doesn't ask for the competitors NDCA numbers, wheras the amateur form does.
The form I'm talking about is here, Chris. http://www.empirestatedancesport.com/forms/AmAmerican-2005.pdf

There appears to be a different age break-down for multi-dance versus 1-dance entries. For multi-dance, there are just two age categories, as MQ mentioned. For 1-dance entries, the break-down is pretty fine, unless I'm misreading the form. And it specificially mentions being danced with pro-am, so we're talking about a different animal. Or maybe I'm confused. *shrug*

Eh. Whatever. :?
 
#65
Oops. Embassy != Empire

But actually it's the same situation, only the Empire form is even more confusing. The multi-dance events are the actual "amatuer" events for which an NDCA (not USABDA) number is required. The one dance events give every appearance of being the student/student events, run under pro/am rules and categories during the pro/am session and not requiring an NDCA number.

If organizers reviewed the policies of their sanctioning organization before designing their entry forms, this would all be a lot clearer.
 
#68
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Laura

New Member
#72
pygmalion said:
That's about as clear as mud. :lol: :lol: Just kidding. :wink: Is there someone who checks ages at these comps? Or is it strictly an honor system?
The Registrar is supposed to check at the comps. I certainly do for all the ones hosted by USA Dance/NorCal, and I know they check at Nationals.

When I was doing Pro/Am, however, they never checked. Also, Pro/Am comps don't have a consistent set of age categories across all comps. However, in all the Pro/Am comps I've ever been in there was absolutely no problem with someone older than "Adult A" dancing in Adult A.
 

Laura

New Member
#73
mamboqueen said:
Are you talking to Jenn or me??

Scholarships (pro am) are actually 21-45 (not 18, thank God for small favors) and over 45. Championships are a little better, 13-35 and 36-50.
Pro/Am comps vary from region to region and organizer to organizer. The ones I used to dance in on the West Coast would have

18-and over
35-and over
above 50

divisions, but not for all styles. Most often there was just 18 and over ("A"), with "B" added for Standard and Smooth.
 

mamboqueen

Well-Known Member
#74
That seems like a reasonable categorization to me. It's just too bad they're not all consistent. I mean, you end up having so many people with no competition -- in fact, I've seen it happen at the 18-35 age level.
 
#75
mamboqueen said:
That seems like a reasonable categorization to me. It's just too bad they're not all consistent.
To me it's Unreasonable: They are telling that old people, say 60 years and over, are not welcome in their competitions. It's unrerasonable that 70-yr old dancers are pitted against 50-yr old dancers. They are fool. How many millionairs among people 60 and over and how many in 20 years old? They are cutting off a lot of millionairs.
 

mamboqueen

Well-Known Member
#76
Well, what if you have one 75-year old person signed up to do 20 dances with no competitors? What's the point? May as well be doing a showcase. Of course, you could always see how registration goes and ask people to combine into a different age group.
 
#77
contracheck said:
How many millionairs among people 60 and over and how many in 20 years old? They are cutting off a lot of millionairs.
How many millionaires over age 60 have amateur partners to enter competitions with? When they do, how many under-60 couples do they have to share the over-50 floor with? Enough to have a negative impact on the quality of their dancing?

But yes, amateur-only competitions have not gone after this market segment to the degree which pro/am comps have in both the pro/am events and the student/student events run next to them. While it wouldn't be fair to limit the present form of either sort of event to this, there is still something of a history of pro/am being a service provided to customers, while amateur is a competition open to entriants. Given the attempts of amateur to recast itself as Olympic dancesport, we may see even some of the present choices neglected, replaced by a "this is what we are looking for a champion of, take it or leave it" approach. Neither that, nor pure customer service seem quite right to me - I'd prefer to see a range of options, but an expectation that people will work towards a moderately broad category rather than expecting something perfectly tailored to their personal needs.
 

Laura

New Member
#78
contracheck said:
mamboqueen said:
That seems like a reasonable categorization to me. It's just too bad they're not all consistent.
To me it's Unreasonable: They are telling that old people, say 60 years and over, are not welcome in their competitions. It's unrerasonable that 70-yr old dancers are pitted against 50-yr old dancers. They are fool. How many millionairs among people 60 and over and how many in 20 years old? They are cutting off a lot of millionairs.
Some USA Dance competitions have created their own "Senior III" category, I don't know what the lower-end age cut-off for that is. It's not an official category, but they still do it.

And as for Pro/Am, I have seen a "C" category for 70-and-older. We used to have two men in our area who competed against each other in it in Standard. One was 75, I think the other was 71. The older one used to joke about how it was unfair to have to dance against the younger -- but he was really joking. Sometimes one would win, sometimes the other.
 

pygmalion

Well-Known Member
#79
mamboqueen said:
Well, what if you have one 75-year old person signed up to do 20 dances with no competitors? What's the point? May as well be doing a showcase. Of course, you could always see how registration goes and ask people to combine into a different age group.
Yes. I figured that was the motivation behind the large age groups. 8)
 
#80
mamboqueen said:
Well, what if you have one 75-year old person signed up to do 20 dances with no competitors? What's the point? May as well be doing a showcase.
Well, then the organizes should do something to attract more oldies rather than depriving opoortunities from them outright.
 

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