Worse for Ballroom Dancing -- Master P or Len?

#41
I never thought the viewer votes were suppose to be based on dance ability. I seem to remember the MC just said, "If you enjoyed watching couple x dance and want to seem them back on the show next week, call this number". I'd consider calling in for Master P just to see a typical beginner perform on the show again!
 
#43
You're right, smooth dancer, that's exactly how it's presented; "Vote for your favourite."

I love this show. I love the exposure it's giving to ballroom and latin dancing and I hope it continues for some time yet. I hope this style of dancing, as beautiful to watch as it feels to do, continues to gain popularity.

I also understand the frustration some dancers may feel watching the show in terms of the music selection, the results, etc. when you consider what training in ballroom and competing in competitions is all about, if you understand what I mean. I've experienced that journey and do understand. My father doesn't like to watch the show because he feels it doesn't represent the "real world" of dancing as we know it, and rightly so; it doesn't. Yet I just put all that aside and watch for the sheer enjoyment of the dancing itself. When all is said and done, to me any exposure to ballroom and latin is "good exposure", right?
 
#45
Yeah, the show doesn't represent the real world of competitive dancing, but it might be better! I once went to a college dance where they had dance contests that were judged mostly on audience applause. The results were certainly influenced by popularity, humor, and other factors besides dance ability, but the contests were much more exciting than ballroom competitions where the judges take a quick look and call out the placements. :)
 
#46
fascination said:
I dont doubt your intent big10 but I can assure you that cornutt was being sincere, perhaps not correct in your view but sincere ....some times really good people just get disappointed at not being taken at face value....
Fair enough. If you know cornutt better than I do, then I'll take your word for his sincerity. If my response painted him with the wrong brush, then I'll apologize. Too bad cornutt won't see it. :mrgreen: I've just seen other "excuses" made for trashing Master P (similar to Kelly Monaco last season) that seemed illogical/inconsistent with how other competitors are viewed, and that bugs me for a variety of reasons.


smooth_dancer said:
I never thought the viewer votes were suppose to be based on dance ability. I seem to remember the MC just said, "If you enjoyed watching couple x dance and want to seem them back on the show next week, call this number".
Yeah, it seems to me that the vast majority of the time the host refers to each "couple" when voting, rather than just the "celebrity." That's why I think a lot of the votes are happening because of Ashly, as well as the entertainment value (however you choose to define that) of them as a "couple."
 
#47
That sounds interesting, and yes, it could be better, I agree. And what a great post about hoping people remember the show for the dancing and not the wacky things. Very true. But there's politics in everything now, isn't there?
I can remember way back when my parents were training me in the medal syllabus and I was taking my medal test. The adjudicator that came to the studio to judge the tests grabbed me by the arm and said, "I was harder on you because of who you are." I was fourteen at the time, I think. My parents were respected and popular competitors in their day and as soon as I began entering competitions, whether pro-am with my dad, or later when I had my own partner, I always knew the pressure was on me because of their popularity. At that age, I didn't have the nerves to take that kind of pressure, and stopped competing in my twenties. I regret that now at times, but today I'm as happy as can be, still in our little studio, still working alongside my dad. Sorry for the useless trivia; didn't mean to ramble!
 
#48
I agree that Ashley has her own fan base. I am surprised she hasn't been picked up for a sitcom or talk show or something. She is very charismatic.

Backstory is very important, and watching P and Ashley together is fun. Last week when there was a short music change in the studio and P started "dancing" Ashley was so surprised it was adorable. Watching them on the basketball court was also charming. In a strange way Ashley is the Kelly of this season. They are very different people but they both have that certain something that gets people rooting for them.
 

fascination

Site Moderator
Staff member
#49
Big10 said:
Fair enough. If you know cornutt better than I do, then I'll take your word for his sincerity. If my response painted him with the wrong brush, then I'll apologize. Too bad cornutt won't see it. :mrgreen: I've just seen other "excuses" made for trashing Master P (similar to Kelly Monaco last season) that seemed illogical/inconsistent with how other competitors are viewed, and that bugs me for a variety of reasons.



"
thank you I believe that is the case
 
#50
caityrosey said:
I just hope that in 2 years or 5 years the people who watched the show will remember the dancing and not the other wacky show politics.

actually what i most care about is getting people into studios NOW. i have had SO many ppl ask me for studio recommendations and stuff as a result of their seeing the show, then meeting me and realizing i'm a dancer.

my perception is that it's working - my usual studio was so crowded on tuesday that i couldn't dance. that has never happened to me before, in 2.5 years.
 
#51
Infosaturated said:
In a strange way Ashley is the Kelly of this season. They are very different people but they both have that certain something that gets people rooting for them.
Now that is a totally different perspective that I hadn't considered. Perhaps Kelly was the hard worker doing the best she could with her own limited talents -- and Ashly is now the hard worker doing the best she can despite her partner's limited talents?
 

DancePoet

Well-Known Member
#52
Infosaturated said:
It's dancing with the STARS, not a "Dancing Contest". Sure the basic format is a dancing contest but there is nothing to win but a very tacky oversized "trophy". The hook is seeing niche stars dance, not the dancing in and of itself.

That a lot of the dancing is actually good to the uneducated eye is a bonus. Take away the celebrities, or the costumes, or the viewer vote, and ratings would fall like a stone and the show would be cancelled.
Ayuh, but like ya said, "the basic format is a dancing contest". *shrug*

If the couples were eliminated by skill it would be very predictable and there would be no point in voting. Jerry and George shouldn't be there any more than Miller because Giselle was clearly better than both of them too.
Good point!

I am a lot more concerned about Jerry advancing than I am Miller because I am pretty sure that as the field narrows he will be eliminated. I don't think he will make the final 3. Jerry may well make the final 3, maybe even the final two.

But then, I am not voting based purely on dancing ability either. I am now rooting for Tia and Drew. My criteria is a mix of dancing and other factors, in this case, likability and potential to boost careers. I wouldn't mind if they don't end up being the final 2, but I don't think either should go before Jerry, George and Miller.

I suspect we may see Stacy and Jerry as the final two with Stacy taking the win.

I'd love to see Tia take the win but I suspect that while she is gaining fans, she doesn't have enough to take her to the top unless she manages the fast dances better than I think she will.
Perhaps he'll make the final three, but if Jerry's dancing doesn't significantly improve hopefully not.
 

DancePoet

Well-Known Member
#53
Big10 said:
Please tell me how "these types of contests" are supposed to be judged. I'm honestly curious. To be more specific, I'm curious about the judging standards for other similar contests where (1) the contestants are pre-selected by the organizers for subjective reasons (not random entries), (2) half of the dancers are dancing one style and the other half are dancing a different style, and (3) the judges don't even seem to have been given identical guidelines on which style of dancing the competitors are supposed to perform. Is there really any other non-televised dance contest like this one?
In answer to your question, it depends on what the word "like" is being viewed as. If you mean exactly alike, well then of course not. However if you mean similar, then yes. Besides, perhaps I'm being misunderstood or unclear?

In my view, just like Infosaturated has posted, DWTS is a "dance contest" in only the loosest fashion possible -- and every single participant knew exactly what he/she was getting into from the very beginning. However, for those of you who are so uptight about who "deserves" to advance, where is your similar sense of righteous outrage over George Hamilton? There is no way that he is a better dancer than Giselle Fernandez, and a decent argument can be made that he wasn't as good as Tatum O'Neal, either. Yet he also survives for another week.....
Frankly, I'm disappointed with Giselle disappearing before George, yet this was a thread about P. v. Len, correct?
 

DancePoet

Well-Known Member
#54
Big10 said:
I can't believe that's what kansas49er intended, because your interpretation makes absolutely no sense to me. Come on, now. :? How could Master P be expected to invent some sort of "ghetto ballroom" in his first month of dancing? (And, by the way, I believe the actual term he used was "Gangster Cha Cha," just for his first dance.) To create some new form of ballroom dancing, a person would have to be skilled enough in the basics of the common form, before being able to "revolutionize" it -- and it's obvious that Master P has only a marginal grasp on even the basics at this point. Plus, he's not even known for having any skill at hip-hop dancing, either. He's just a rapper, producer, and business owner as far as I know.

If anybody hates Master P mainly because he hasn't helped Ashly to create "ghetto ballroom," then that person has less of a grasp on reality than Master P had on the Cha Cha. :roll:
I didn't read anything about someone hating Master P. Perhaps I'm confused?
 

DancePoet

Well-Known Member
#55
alemana said:
actually what i most care about is getting people into studios NOW. i have had SO many ppl ask me for studio recommendations and stuff as a result of their seeing the show, then meeting me and realizing i'm a dancer.

my perception is that it's working - my usual studio was so crowded on tuesday that i couldn't dance. that has never happened to me before, in 2.5 years.
Whether we like P or Len OR not, the show really does seem to be bring interest to ballroom! :D

Last night I sat with two teenage boys watching the show, and at the end one of them is actually considering taking ballroom dance lessons. :banana:

(DP, don't get too excited, teenage boys can sometimes be rather fickle.)

Ah! But it is a break in the closed off attitude they had before to the notion of even giving it a try. ;)
 

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